SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Yes, no fear of this being put on me. If it goes that way I am done, but that doesn't align with the material this guy puts out.

MC starting on d-day was a great help to us. That was because our MC (who was my W's IC, which is how we got time with her on d-day) did NOT indicate in any way that our M or I caused my W's A. Our MC sessions were all about the A all the time until I was done talking about it. Then the sessions were only about the A when I brought it up. Most of the sessions were about how my W fucked up and what she needed to do to keep doing the right things in the future.

So if your MC asks your W why she cheated and knocks down her reasons, MC can help. If your MC tells your W she's responsible for her choices, MC can help.

*****

The more I think about it, the less I want to rely on WS for healing. She wants to repair things, so that's nice but the more I process this, the more I see a need for self sufficiency. Why set my hopes on such a shaky foundation?

Good insight. Your W simply can't heal you. The only help she can give you is emotional support. You are responsible for healing yourself.

You do that by resolving your feelings - anger, grief, fear, shame, etc. - and letting them go. A good IC can help you do that.

It's a lot easier to say than to do. Trauma is awful in many ways, especially in the way that today's trauma can bring back memories of every other trauma you've experienced. No matter how charmed your life might have been up to now, your brain probably has memories of events it (your brain) decided was traumatic.

You'll probably find one feeling more comfortable than others. You'll have to work through that feeling in order to get to the others. Then you'll have to get through the other feelings.

And none of this is linear - you'll think you're going in circles, and you may be.

But resolving the feelings is eminently doable, and each feeling you resolve frees your energy to resolve others. Each feeling you resolve also clears your mind so you can think straighter and perceive reality with more accuracy.

*****

I understand you don't know much that's useful right now. Being betrayed - any trauma - is disorienting, and the bigger the trauma, the more the disorientation.

My reco is to let your emotions flow and to ride the waves. Aim to figure out what you want. It's entirely possible that you don't want to spend the rest of your life with your W. That probably makes D your better choice.

If you're uncertain, or if you want R, my reco is to think about how you will know if R is working or not. What indicators will tell you how R is proceeding?

Those indicators can be turned into your requirements for R. Share them with your W. If she signs on or negotiates a different requirement that looks good to you, R can start. If she won't sign on, R probably won't work.

The thing is: the requirements need to be observable and measurable. If your W steps up, great. If she fails but corrects her course when she monitors her behavior against the requirements, great. Both are positive for R. If she doesn't step up and/or correct course, great - that's positive for D.

If you keep wanting R, great. If you decide down the line you want D, even if your W is exceeding requirements, great.

Common requirements are: No Contact, total honesty/no more lies about anything, IC for WS with a goal of changing from cheater to good partner, you have total access to all her media, MC if one of you wants it.

Just to make it explicit: I hope you go for the optimal resolution for you - but you have to find your own path from this devastation to a good life. I can't know if that's D or R at this point; maybe you can't, either. But you can hold your head high either way, if you make mindful choices.

*****

It looks like you have faith in yourself. That's a great start. When you fall into self-doubt, remind yourself you can survive and thrive whether you D or R. When you feel weak, remind yourself that healing is DIFFICULT, and focusing on healing takes strength whether you feel strong or not..

And BE PATIENT. Recovery is a marathon , not a sprint. Think 2-5 years to recover. You may heal sooner; healing may take longer. If you choose R, you may R in 2-5 years or sooner or later or not at all.

But 2-5 years is a good rule of thumb, as long as you remember it's just a rule of thumb.

But never forget:

1) You heal you. Your WS may help (or hinder) your healing, but the responsibility is yours, and only you can do the necessary work.

2) Your WS heals themself. You may help (or hinder) their healing, but the responsibility is theirs, and only they can do the necessary work.

3) If you both want to rebuild your M, you can do it. You can even heal your M while you're heaing yourselves.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 6:21 PM, Friday, October 3rd]

I pushed for MC immediately because I didn't know any better. In one of our first few sessions we were talking about the conversation my wife and I had in my truck the day I confronted her. The reason I held the conversation in the truck is so that we had privacy and the kids would not hear

The MC asked my wife how she felt in the truck and she said trapped, scared, unsafe, and I shot back immediately with you were never unsafe. I wasn't yelling I wasn't screaming I wasn't out of control.

I said she wasn't locked in the truck. I never touched her. I never threatened her so I have no idea where this so-called feeling unsafe is coming from. Her saying she felt unsafe was a BS excuse in my opinion, she was looking for sympathy from the MC

The MC turned to me and said do you feel like you should apologize and I said no and she said but your wife is telling you she felt unsafe and I said okay? She was never unsafe, and again the MC pushed me to apologize and I said no. She said could you have held the conversation somewhere else where your wife would have felt safer and I said I don't know, ask my wife. I chose the truck so we would have privacy

Now the MC was getting irritated and again she pushed me to apologize and I said I will not apologize because I didn't do anything wrong

Skip the MC for several months until you think you want to save the marriage

OP - do you really want to stay married to this woman? I can understand practical reasons like the kids or money, but....do you REALLY want to stay married to this woman? Would you marry her again knowing she could do this? If you didn't have kids, would you stay with her? Yes? Because you love her? Well....what does that love mean? WHY? I think a lot of times we're just afraid of being alone, of rocking the boat, of hurting the kids, and we end up hurting ourselves.

It sounds like she is still wrapped up in the boss to some extent - and that he is still pursuing her (if I read you correctly) is very disturbing. She should have block on all fronts, and she should not be in that job either, if she still is. If someone values their marriage they have to do what ever they can to preserve and strengthen it. That does not include horny bosses.

It's not clear to me from your post but if she's also cheated with someone else....then I don't really know if she's marriage material. I'd say no. She should at least be trying to be faithful and it doesn't sound like she's trying very hard and it doesn't sound like you're the Man of Her Dreams....or she's even pretending that. Sometimes people marry or stay married because they know someone is safe or productive or predictable, etc, and maybe that's the case with her and then she runs around with some bad boy loser type or the one she views as the "powerful guy". What it comes down to is a profound lack of respect and desire for you. If she had those things.....she wouldn't cheat like this. She just wouldn't. This woman is not in love with you. Whether you can be in a marriage with that or not, you have to figure out for yourself. I wouldn't want this to be me. But it's very common. I think especially for women who cheat. So....I would consider a divorce, that's my usual answer to these situations because I think it IS the best solution....someone who cheats like this is not in love with you. She'll lie to you about that sure, but the behavior is what matters. Can she fall in love with you? I don't know, if it ain't there now, probably not. People want to say it's all psychological problems, etc, but Juliet didn't cheat on Romeo. People who really love and respect their mates generally don't. People who have other reasons for marriage, very well may.

It probably hurts to hear this, I know, but here's the upside. There are billions of women all around the world, who would LOVE to meet a nice, stable, kind, responsible, intelligent, family man who goes through life trying to do his best. YOU ARE A CATCH. Maybe not her catch because she's deluded, but YOU ARE A CATCH. You just don't realize this. Don't go through life mourning that someone did you bad because she doesn't appreciate you.....think of all the women who would do you RIGHT because they'd appreciate the man you are and want to be with you. There's far more than you think.

So consider yourself the prize to be won. If you need to boost your self esteem with improving yourself physically, as we all often let ourselves go a bit with age....me too....then improve that. But don't let your self worth or you ability to have a relationship be based on this one deluded woman's idea about love. What she has been looking for isn't real but I doubt if that will change. VALUE YOURSELF HIGHER.

You’re one of the few who have their stuff together in the face of some brutal trauma.
You’re going to be ok no matter what happens or what she does.

@BondJaneBond - honestly, I don't know. It's a huge burden imposed on my life no matter how this goes. I think I don't need to decide that right now. I'm focused on feeling better, getting my sleep normal and being able to work without needing to cry in the toilet. I may R or D; I think what @sisoon says aligns to my mindset (at this exact moment). My wife may do a ton of work (or none) and it may still not matter. I get to decide that.

BS went NC immediately when I found out. She didn't understand/empathise initially but is now quite remorseful and I think there was an earlier mention of unconditional surrender. If she's not there, she is close. This morning she said "I know I can never make this up to you but I hope you'll let me spend the rest our lives trying".

It says on one of the starter threads that no matter what happens, everybody BS here eats a shit sandwich, and that's the truth.

I didn't deserve this. I didn't chose this path. My wife has been horrible to me. Truly terrible. I'm also not at the start of the journey looking into a certain future although I will admit there are some very poor signs. I'm halfway along and have taken a wayward trail. Rather than panic I'm going to do what I always do which is puzzle out what makes the most sense. Can she change? Yes. Do I care? Yes.

Will it be enough? Too soon to tell.

But I know that my mood swings up and down like a yoyo and that's not a great place to be making permanent decisions from.

Just to clarify: Affair is totally done. I have full digital transparency and NC has been locked in since day 1. I won't say it was appropriate but it wasn't "romantic" for her. I'm not okay with that but it gave me less to fight through than many here who have partners who are in a fog etc. I worry about her self-rationalisation at the time (she is not excusing it, says she was selfish and in the light of day is horrified by what she has done and how badly I am impacted).

In summary: This sucks. I'm still figuring things out. I appreciate all the input and perspectives. Please keep sharing.

Could you share where you read about the shit sandwich in a starter thread?
It’s a relatively new phrase on this site, so I would be surprised if it was in a pinned thread, other than in a relatively recent post on said thread.

I get it that we the BS need to accept that our wayward spouse did things that are not acceptable within a marriage. I also get it that if we reconcile, we need to find a way to digest what they did and live with it. I guess you could call that by the emotionally culinary name of a "shit sandwich".
What I don’t get is when some posters insist that ANY and ALL that have been cheated on but decide to reconcile are doomed to a future of regular servings of said sandwich...

Frankly – I find that thought insulting to our host MangledHeart. Sort of like inviting yourself to a party, double dipping the Dorito’s and pissing in the pool.
His wife, the sadly missed Deeply Scared who was integral in creating and setting the path of this site, was a wayward wife. I guess he had to deal with accepting that the wife he decided to reconcile with forced him to digest some difficult truths. I doubt he digested that thought only once, but I’m also fairly certain he got over it and moved on. I’m also guessing the infidelity was always somewhere there in their marital dynamics, but no longer a controlling factor. I don’t think he started each morning trying to down some "shit-sandwich" while looking at his wife.

Reconciling is so much more than just remaining married despite an affair.

Nrtdd – Maybe the one good thing you have going for you is time. Problem is that time can also make you become comfortable with a status quo. It’s a delicate balancing act where you utilize the time you have to delay burning a bridge behind you while still keeping momentum. For me – as someone trying to guide you – the goal isn’t to get you to reconcile nor divorce. It’s to get you out of infidelity.
Just keep in mind that infidelity can still be there even if she’s not in contact with someone else. If the key-factors that make her decide this is such a great idea aren’t dealt with then it’s probably only a question until the next affair begins. With reconciliation I would want to see the two of you work together at a good marriage, not simply hiding behind some excuse about the kids or finances and accepting a bad or mediocre marriage.

I won't say it was appropriate but it wasn't "romantic" for her. I'm not okay with that but it gave me less to fight through than many here who have partners who are in a fog etc.

So, thinking it wasn’t romantic for your WS may make all this a little easier for you, what would trouble me even more is this.

OM was her boss. She brought him close to our family, had him meet my parents. Basically became a like an uncle to the point where he is their legal guardian if we pass away in some horrible accident.

This level of disrespect is off the charts for me. How many times when you were all together did they exchange knowing smiles and glances? How many times when they were alone did that laugh and joke about you oblivious humiliation? Or, just how dense you and even your parents were? I doubt I could get past this level of cruelty. Have you discussed this with your WW and how has she acted/responded. The truth is, you’ll probably never know the how she really feels about this. Just food for thought.

nrtd - I think you're focusing on the right things - self care is critical at this point because you have to stay strong for yourself and your kids. I think focusing on YOURSELF at this point should be your main focus. I would not do anything to bend over backwards for your wife, to me she has to earn that and it starts by recognizing the magnitude of what she did. I think a lot of WS not only don't WANT to get this, but I think they may just not get it because they have different attitudes towards marriage and sex which frankly, may not be compatible or in agreement with the BS. Take your time, whatever you need, take care of yourself and the kids first, and really, I would not worry about engaging with the spouse, or understanding her, or fussing over her, or helping her or anything like that. She had the affair because SHE WANTED TO. You know what you know and the fact that she did what she did shows how she regards you and the marriage. Actions are always what matters. So be selfish, do what benefits you and the kids first, don't worry about her, it's her job to make up to YOU. If she can't figure that out without being led step by step especially by an MC, then maybe she can't figure it out and she's not the right partner for you. The right partner is often revealed by crisis, whether from without like a death or job loss, or from within from a crisis she has manufactured herself.

At this point, just put you and the kids first and take your time to calm down, strengthen yourself, know your feelings and figure out what your legal and financial options are. Don't be quick to reconcile.

As we're talking about MCs here, I think we have to recognize that the MCs goal is to HEAL THE MARRIAGE, not the individuals, that's an IC job. To heal the marriage they try to make both parties accept guilt or responsibility over anything that might make them feel united in causing and doing infidelity. This is often not true, of course, certainly not with cheating but that's why they try to "blame" the BS to create a fake equality - to put both parties on equal footing. This should not apply to infidelity which is almost always a one sided decision and set of actions that really, IMO, BLOWS UP A MARRIAGE. I think infidelity, certainly a real affair as opposed to a ONS or online fantasy, is a basic negation of marriage and it's setting off a bomb that destroys marriages, even those that think they have "reconciled". It cuts the most basic ties. Personally I think it's generally a marriage ender, which the Bible reflects in its statements. So I personally would not go to an MC about something like this as they are going to try to make the BS feel guilty and responsible too, unless they have had special training about infidelity and trauma issues. Most have not.

@Bigger

I get it that we the BS need to accept that our wayward spouse did things that are not acceptable within a marriage. I also get it that if we reconcile, we need to find a way to digest what they did and live with it. I guess you could call that by the emotionally culinary name of a "shit sandwich".

I'm posting to defend the "shit sandwich" analogy; I'm personally a big fan of its use.

​Your initial understanding of the analogy aligns with how I commonly see it applied: it refers to the initial, unenviable decision-making process facing the betrayed spouse.

​To be clear, I don't see many arguments—even from those heavily in the anti-reconciliation camp, like myself—suggesting it's impossible for a marriage to be rebuilt, for a BS to move past the betrayal, or for them to eventually find happiness. It's clear that many people do build a happy life post-infidelity. The degree to which reconciling partners fully recover is a separate, debatable discussion.

​The analogy's power lies in how it frames the two fundamental choices:

- ​Divorce and Invest in Yourself: You take the difficult plunge of divorce, recover, and attempt to find a different, more loyal partner—a "BLT", which is surely the most trustworthy of all sandwiches.

​- Accept and Hope for Change: You choose to accept that the person you've loved the most is capable of the most fundamental betrayal and hope that, over time, she can develop into that loyal "BLT" partner.

​To further elaborate on your point, this is where the two common camps of thought emerge. I don't think either side doubts that, under the right circumstances, a "shit sandwich" can transform. However, one camp believes that with enough effort, the transformation is complete and the whiff of "shit" entirely fades. The other camp believes that no matter how perfectly they morph into a "BLT," the original smell—the painful memory and knowledge of the betrayal—is always faintly there.

​Ultimately, I think whether that residual "smell" bothers a person is less about the unfaithful partner and more about the character and resilience of the betrayed spouse.

This perfectly hands off to another one of this sites best analogies. Imagine your relationship is a favorite pint glass, a vessel you trusted. Infidelity is like someone deliberately pouring something foul into it, tainting the glass. Even if you rinse it out, the memory of what was in it lingers. The challenge is whether you can ever trust that glass to hold a clean, refreshing drink again, or if you will always be worried about the lingering residue.

Id always whiff the shit and see many like me posting here years into reconciliation. Hence my anti-R stance. Though I'm aware I'm not perfect and will be impacted by biases.

[This message edited by DRSOOLERS at 12:15 PM, Sunday, October 5th]

BS went NC immediately when I found out. She didn't understand/empathise initially but is now quite remorseful and I think there was an earlier mention of unconditional surrender. If she's not there, she is close. This morning she said "I know I can never make this up to you but I hope you'll let me spend the rest our lives trying".

***

I didn't deserve this. I didn't chose this path. My wife has been horrible to me. Truly terrible. I'm also not at the start of the journey looking into a certain future although I will admit there are some very poor signs. I'm halfway along and have taken a wayward trail. Rather than panic I'm going to do what I always do which is puzzle out what makes the most sense. Can she change? Yes. Do I care? Yes.

You're about a month out from d day? My WW and I are trying to work things out and she's about as close to a good candidate for R as I could have hoped for, but the first couple of weeks were pretty rough and she wasn't giving me the best signs during that time. She did however, end up changing her attitude 180 degrees and was saying the same things I highlighted above that your wife is saying by the 1 month point, but she was pretty brutal at first, especially on d day itself, until I started calling divorce lawyers and real estate agents.

Your wife isn't my wife, your situation has some extenuating circumstances that we didn't have to deal with (OM wasn't entangled in our family lives with him being our children's godfather, plus my WWs PA was very short lived) and I don't want to give you any sense of false hope, but her saying the above is a positive sign if you decide R is in your wheelhouse. If she follows up with consistent actions and maintains that attitude she puts me in mind of my wife and we've made incredible progress in the last 6 months.

What you're going through is likely the hardest thing you've ever dealt with and the emotions you're feeling are normal. Give yourself some space and breathing room before you make any permanent decisions. Keep posting here and vent when you need to.

** Member to Member **

The D/R decision is about the future, not the past. We all have to gather enough info to make our best guess about what the future will bring. One potential guide is in the work of John Gottman and his adherents. They've done a lot of research on what keeps couples together. Gottman and Silver's 7 Principles for Making Marriage Work provides a high level outline of their findings up to the time it was published.

I suggest getting a copy and seeing where you fit. As it happened, both my W and I fit naturally into the group that stayed together. If I had read the book soon after d-day, my confidence level that R would work would have been a lot higher than it was.

The thing is: Gottman, et al., argue that even if you're in the group that usually splits, you can change behavior and move into the group that stays together if you want to change.

IOW, R is possible in many situations, if both partners do the necessary work. No one - BS or WS - is obligated to choose R.You can hold your head high whether you D or R. But don't let fear drive your choice.

Again, nrtd, you seem to be on the right track. Stay courageous.

*****

Why would anyone want to R if they thought it meant eating a shit sandwich?

My W betrayed me. I had to accept that, at least in some ways - I had to choose between holding onto and releasing the pain. But it was immediately obvious that I bore no responsibility for the A. All I had to do was work through my thoughts and feelings and decide between D & R.

It wasn't what I wanted in my life, but I knew I didn't control my W and didn't want to. The A affected me, but it said nothing about me. I did not experience eating a sandwich de la merde, In fact, the A wasn't the worst trauma I've experienced in my pretty lucky life, so if the A is a shit sandwich, I'd have to come up with something worse for other traumas.

To R, I had to let go of a desire for revenge. I fought a lot with my kid brother when we were young, and I knew that revenge was never satisfying for long, so I knew I'd benefit more than anyone else by giving revenge up.. I saw no sandwich de la merde in R - if I had, I'd have chosen D.

I know some people view R as a continuous diet of shit. That's fine - for them. I just wish they'd understand that not all people respond the way they do.

*****

To heal the marriage they try to make both parties accept guilt or responsibility over anything that might make them feel united in causing and doing infidelity.

That's an over-generalization. Our MC got the role because she was my W's IC and could see us on d-day.

As my W's IC, she had a fiduciary duty to her, so I didn't have a lot of hope. I expected to hear a lot about my W's problems at the session. Instead, she (MC) gave me a LOT of support and my W, a lot of confrontation. That continues as long as the A was the issue.

At no time did she suggest that anything I did caused the A in any way except by trusting my W before and during her A. Later, when I raised the issue of not trusting my W (30 months after d-day), our MC said it wasn't an issue - 'It's too early,' she said.

I know that the majority of MCs are trained in system theory. I agree that a random MC is likely to see an A as a symptom of a problem in the M. But it should be clear that some MCs get it right, and they can be identified by asking a few questions. One may be unable to find a good MC, but the bad ones can be identified pretty easily.

Sure, I know most people don't ask the necessary questions right after d-day. That's extremely unfortunate. I wish there were a 3-digit number to call and get good info on recovering from infidelity. SI is the best I know of.

*****

This statement:

​To be clear, I don't see many arguments—even from those heavily in the anti-reconciliation camp, like myself—suggesting it's impossible for a marriage to be rebuilt, for a BS to move past the betrayal, or for them to eventually find happiness. It's clear that many people do build a happy life post-infidelity.

does not fit with this one:

Id always whiff the shit and see many like me posting here years into reconciliation. Hence my anti-R stance.

I do not understand how someone can be anti-R while acknowledging that some people R. That implies either 1) not believing the people who say they've R'ed or 2) believing that one's own bias overrides the evidence.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 6:30 PM, Sunday, October 5th]

I do not understand how someone can be anti-R while acknowledging that some people R.

How is this confusing? He’s merely saying he *personally* would never choose R, and also acknowledging some do successfully R after adultery.

The one complaint I have about this forum is that we only have the very shortened version of someone’s life. And it can’t be helped so we try to work around it. Occasionally a BS will write about some behavior of the WS that’s so egregious none of us think there should be a reconciliation. However, if the WS is truly remorseful, and regretful, and alters every behavior that they’ve had, and they are forgiven by the BS, that’s not our business.

I understand why IC asks questions about the relationship but, in the end, one person decided to cheat. You cannot get around that. But, a caveat. If the bs was in a chaotic family as a child they often drift toward behaviors that are familiar, hence, choosing a partner who mistreats them. At that point cheating might be an exit affair. It is hard for me to judge someone who has been so beaten down by life that they get out any way they can. I do think those people are in minority however. Most cheaters do so because they want to.

[This message edited by Cooley2here at 9:34 PM, Sunday, October 5th]

@sisoon

I think gr8ful kind of succinctly summarized my position but to expand:

I'm generally anti-swinging and can see a lot of scope for it doing damage to many relationships. I can hold this position whilst simultaneously acknowledging that for many people, it's a healthy and enjoyable lifestyle. I can even acknowledge the many accounts from couples who claim it has strengthen or even saved their marriage. On the whole, my position remains unchanged. I'm still anti-swinging.

Surely you are in principle against many concepts but can acknowledge that they are right for some people, some of the time?

I'm against R on the whole but am not blind enough to see that it isn't the best option for many people.

[This message edited by DRSOOLERS at 9:38 AM, Monday, October 6th]

"I know I can never make this up to you but I hope you'll let me spend the rest our lives trying".

Wow lucky you. She gets the thrill of the chases, the secrecy of illicit messages, the meetings for sex, then she gets caught and gets to play patron saviour

Nrtdd

Maybe the key element for you in the above discussions is that the advice offered on this site varies.
I have very seldom over the years seen advice that I have felt compelled to warn against, and when that happens it tends to be something that can cause legal trouble. Like kicking a spouse out or changing the locks. Haven’t seen anything along those lines here so far. I would like to learn where you heard about the shit-sandwich in a marked thread, because there is a vast difference in using that terminology to describe what you as a BH might have to deal with early-days, or suggesting you become "someone who reconciles is seen as volunteering to continue to eat the shit sandwich" as was posted recently.

I don’t agree with some of the advice offered by some, but since we don’t have any appropriate yardstick to measure any of the advice offered then I’m not going to say if it’s better or worse than mine. That’s the beauty of it – you can pick and choose.

What I do suggest you do is look up past posts by users that get your attention. See what they have been saying in comparable situations. Do they have an agenda? Are they pressing for a certain solution no matter what? Sometimes that makes sense – like I freely admit I do have an agenda. My agenda is to make you realize you have options that might be open to you, and that you can work along whatever option is open and you want, but that it's pointless to work on a closed option.

This is all helpful. I don't recall which post had the SS reference. Trying to find it more and I can't. I definitely take the view that posters being their own thoughts and biases that I need to sort through. No poster can share all context so responses are based on limited info coming from a poster who may have left out important details.

The idea of accepting A happened and moving on seems difficult. WS has been especially remorseful the last bit, so I could see a path there but eventually I'll have to acknowledge and move on from the A of we go that way. The only way that makes sense is in a marriage that is better and stronger than before.

I will say, without blaming myself for the A that our marriage has been fraught with the same complaint for a long time: WS doesn't feel I pull my weight at home and presents it much as my doing nothing every time we fight about it.

I don't agree with that extreme description but I acknowledge that she does more than her fair share. There are reasons why this has been hard to resolve mostly down to how we approach doing things (I prefer clear breakdown of responsibilities, she wants me to notice things needing doing).

There is an article sums the issue up well on Huffington post titled:
she-divorced-me-i-left-dishes-by-the-sink

So, I have my own stuff to sort out as well, but she could have left or done as I'd asked (figure out roles and responsibilities). Both preferable to A. Since A I have forced the issue (defined r&r) and the problem has disappeared. Had I done so earlier I don't know that A would have happened... But I had my own complaints and unmet needs over many years and didn't become a WS. This last point I think is critical.

So anyways, I accept my part in making M not always a great place to be for WS and that would need to be different for R to be achievable. She would need to do the same AND fix whatever it was that let her choose A.

The idea of accepting A happened and moving on seems difficult.

I personally left the relationship where my then-fiancé cheated. I left for several reasons (including I was young and possibly impulsive), but mainly because it was relatively easy (from a practical stance, what with no kids, no mortgage...). Yet it took me time to realize what had taken place and accept it, and to accept that this happened through no fault of my own. Something I had to do eventually to fully move on.

No matter what you decide on – reconcile or divorce – you need to learn how to accept this happened and move on. Yes – it is difficult.

Move on does not imply ignoring it, denying it, pretending it never happened or anything like that. If you divorce you will still need to have (preferably) amicable interaction with her regarding the kids. If you reconcile... well... it wouldn’t be a marriage if this was constantly the leading thought you had regarding your wife and your marriage. In fact that wouldn’t be reconciling, but rather trying to live with this big pink elephant in your life. Remain married and you two need to spend a lot of time on accepting the A happened and how to progress from that fact.

Possibly the biggest task ahead (short-term) is accepting it happened and discovering under what circumstances you are OK with "moving on". That could lead to you wanting a divorce or it could make you find a path to reconcile.

Chances are that this will be on your mind and in your life in some way or another for what’s left of it. It’s up to you how big an impact it has onwards. Totally irrespective of how your relationship ends up.

Ps. The workload at home thing... Definitely a factor in the marriage satisfaction department, but no relevance to her decision to have these affairs. If you fall into the (probably self-set) trap of thinking your behaviors helped her decide to have an affair, then what could happen if you forget to take out the trash or to buy milk on the way home? Would that explain or justify flirting with a male-colleague?

[This message edited by SI Staff at 5:30 PM, Monday, October 6th]

Reconciliation is extremely difficult, even if both are committed.

If you want to try, get the McDonald book recommended earlier, How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair. Read it and give it to her.

I found I could forgive but I can never forget. The marriage will never be the same.